Willie Frazer put's his big sectarian foot in it.

[earl]

What an idiot!!

Here's from the FAIR site:

Victims in Irish UK Passport Row

Members of FAIR many of who paid a high price to remain British have recently been issued with UK passport written in Irish. Such was their shock and anger that they contacted our office to complain. We took this matter up with Members of Parliament in order to get an explanation as to why UK passports issued in Northern Ireland carried the Irish language.

We believe that UK passports issued elsewhere in the United Kingdom are different and do not carry any regional minority languages. This is clearly a dilution of our Britishness and for ever denotes UK citizens resident in Northern Ireland as different and lesser than their counterparts in England Scotland and Wales.

This is especially galling as the DUP promised an end to the upsurge in Irish language. However it would appear that the legislation they shelved was merely a side show while the real use of Irish to lay claim to every person in N Ireland moves forward.

This is not the case in the rest of the UK and we are sickened that those in our country who fought and sacrificed most to remain British are dealt such an insult. We will be raising this with MPs at Westminster as it is clear that local MLAs have no real say. We also intend to take up the fight with the Foreign and Commonwealth office which for decades has operated an agenda of diminishing diluting and destroying out Britishness.

Victims' campaigner Willie Frazer hit out angrily last night at what he described as a UK passport written in Irish.

However a spokesperson for the Home Office in London, which issues passports, said that passports include some Welsh and Scots-Gaelic as well as English, but the Irish language was not used.

In a statement Mr Frazer, pictured, described the passport as "diluting his Britishness".

He said: "We believe that UK passports issued elsewhere in the United Kingdom are different and do not carry any regional minority languages.

"This is clearly a dilution of our Britishness and forever denotes UK citizens resident in Northern Ireland as different and lesser than their counterparts in England, Scotland and Wales."

_________________________________________________________

;D ;D ;D What a plonker! Shows how much he actually knows about the country he so vocally shouts for! Someone should explain to the man that there are more British languages than just english! He was so busy taking insult to this and trying to set up a new campaign, that it never dawned on him that it might be Scots-gaelic! Not British enough for him eh? It just goes to show, that for some Unionists, their idea of Britishness is so narrow in focus, that when they mean British, they actually mean English. The only way that this could of been funnier is if it was Ulster Scots! Best laugh I've had all week! And even if it was Irish on it, what does Willie mean that it makes them lesser citizens? This clearly shows that Willie has it in his head that Irish people are 'below' British people. Fuckin' bigot.

[earl]

Actually, come to think of it, maybe ol' Wille has a point. The new British passports have English, Scots Gaelic and Welsh on them, but no Irish or Ulster Scots. So he's correct in saying that NI citizens are getting treated differently, i.e. being completely ignored!

[Shades40]

Just read about this

FAIR was formed as an non-sectarian, non-political organisation to work in the interests of the innocent victims of terrorism in South Armagh.

Pure lies then willie! not that we didn't already know you were just a bitter twisted little man, good luck with your new campaign you embarrassment ;D

[Shades40]

From the man himself............

Name: william frazer
Homepage URL: http://ulster
Comments: REF THE VILE SECTARIAN BILE YOU TALK ABOUT ON THIS SITE,IT IS NOT THE FAULT OF US THAT IT IS THE TRUTH AND WHAT TOOK PLACE IN SOUTH ARMAGH.
FIND SOMETHING ON THIS SITE THAT IS A LIE,AND THEY COME BACK AND SHOOT YOUR MOUTH OFF.
CHRISTIANITY IS SOMETHING YOU DONT SEEM TO KNOW ALOT ABOUT?
IF YOU DID THE QUESTION WOULD HAVE BEEN ABOUT HOU YOU COULD HELP THESE SICK PEOPLE THAT DID THIS ON A COMMUNITY.
BUT YOU DONT LIKE THE TRUTH DO YOU SCUM BAG.
Friday, January 4th 2008 - 05:36:53 PM

He is really beginning to lose the plot now, just as well the police wouldn't issue him a gun the man is a MANIAC

[earl]

Sure it states on their website:
"“Last year FAIR organised a parade in Dublin to highlight collusion between the Irish government and the Garda.”

OMG!! A states government colluding with the states policing body!! Maybe he's used to the RUC doing whatever the fcuk they wanted behind he's governments back, but in every single other democracy, the government works with it's police force.


Here's a quiz to our unionist friends, which of these phrases do you find more insulting:

Rìoghachd Aonaichte Bhreatainn is Èireann a Tuath

Or

Ríocht Aontaithe na Breataine Móire agus Thuaisceart Éireann.

One's a Bristish language, and the other is Irish, both saying the exact same thing.

[Blue Angel]

oh for goodness sake frazer is just getting beyond words. I try not to be too personally insulting to the man as I do have some sympathy for what he has gone through and although I've never lost family to violence I'd lost most of my family by the time I was 18 due to things like childhood deaths or terminal illnesses so I know how tramautic disruptions like losing a lot of family members are.

But really there is only so far you can stretch things and his personal tragedies can not be always used as an excuse for the bitterness and sheer nonsense he talks at times - this for example is just sheer stupidity, is Frazer trying to take a giant leap backwards yet again to where we have second class citizens with a second class culture up in the north. Has it not dawned on him that speaking Irish does not make one a mad terrorist as he seems to almost equate one with the other. On a sad note I don't love spelling or grammar nazis but some of the wording and text on his side is just positively stupid - the link to the passport affair goes on about 'insultive behaviour' - whatever that is....

[Wasp]

OMG!! A states government colluding with the states policing body!! Maybe he's used to the RUC doing whatever the fcuk they wanted behind he's governments back, but in every single other democracy, the government works with it's police force.

So the RUC are the only force that you alledge done things behind there governments back? Are you saying there is no chance of any truth in any alledged collusion between the gardai and the ira which would have been done (hopefully) behind the Irish governments back? Well maybe apart from Haughey and co.

[Jim]

The fellas a twat, end of.

[Blue Angel]

i'm beginning to think that's about all that can be said about him - we have a fine collection of these type of idiots from both orange and green tradition on the island sadly still.

[leeside]

What a fuking retard!!

[Wasp]

Well I for one do not agree with all he says, but I admire his stance. How many of us here suffered as his family have? Most of us suffered nothing as far as the loss of a loved one is concerned and the worst most of us ever suffered ranged between name calling, getting your car searched or getting a hiding. Now compare that to what Willie has suffered and I wander if any of us would go unaffected.

FFS most on here have come out with sectarian bigoted rants yet all to quick to condemn a man who has really suffered.

[earl]

wasp said:

OMG!! A states government colluding with the states policing body!! Maybe he's used to the RUC doing whatever the fcuk they wanted behind he's governments back, but in every single other democracy, the government works with it's police force.

So the RUC are the only force that you alledge done things behind there governments back? Are you saying there is no chance of any truth in any alledged collusion between the gardai and the ira which would have been done (hopefully) behind the Irish governments back? Well maybe apart from Haughey and co.

I didn't even mention the IRA, and neither does Wille. It clearly states collusion between Gardaí and the government. Where are you pulling the IRA from? And to directly answer your question, there is no truth between the Gardaí, as an organisation, systematically colluding with the IRA. You mention Haughey and I would like to remind you of who caught and stopped that delivery of weapons, the Gardaí. If the Gardaí were colluding at a high level in it's organisation, then surely that weapons shipment would have passed into the country and none of us would have even known about it. It would have been similar to the weapons 'mysteriously' disappearing from UDR barracks. If you knew the history of this island, you would know that the Gardaí and IRA have been enemies ever since the civil war. Now I'm not going to say that there wasn't a single Garda involved in colluding with the IRA, because I don't believe that is true. I believe that the Gardaí would have been infiltrated by a number of IRA members and sympathisers who used their position to gather information. Kind of like in that film 'The Departed'.

[earl]

I would like someone from the Unionist community to explain this one to me:

"This is clearly a dilution of our Britishness and forever denotes UK citizens resident in Northern Ireland as different and lesser than their counterparts in England, Scotland and Wales."

Willies twisted and bigoted logic has it that if Irish was on the passport, that it would somehow make Unionists 'lesser' than their fellow citizens in Britain. I would like to know the thinking behind this mindset. How would having Irish on it, make you 'lesser'? He seems to think that 'different' is bad, yet Unionists are always stating that the UK is all about the differences coming together under one nation. So why is it that there are Unionists like Willie whose idea of Unionism is so narrow that their identity is almost entirely made up of the common aspect of Britishness and almost completely shuns the aspect of Britishness where there are differences?

Also, we know the reality of the situation. There is Scots-Gaelic, Welsh and English on the passport. 3 of the 5 indigenous languages within the borders of the modern UK. None of the indigenous languages from NI are on it. So, Willie was right. NI is being treated differently, in that it is completely ignored. In this specific issue at least, there is no parity between the other home nations, who are all represented culturally on the passport, and NI.

I would also like to know why Unionists find Irish so offensive? English originated from franco/german languages, Irish and Scots Gaelic are both indigenous to these islands (now that the Celtic invasion theory is being put to bed), which means that in Unionist logic, Irish would be more British than English, and is the cultural glue between Scotland and Ireland. Irish and Scots Gaelic are very similar, and they only started to diverge as late as the 17th century.

[Wasp]

I would like someone from the Unionist community to explain this one to me:

"This is clearly a dilution of our Britishness and forever denotes UK citizens resident in Northern Ireland as different and lesser than their counterparts in England, Scotland and Wales."

Willies twisted and bigoted logic has it that if Irish was on the passport, that it would somehow make Unionists 'lesser' than their fellow citizens in Britain. I would like to know the thinking behind this mindset.

For starters I don't agree with him here but at the sametime I would not want Irish on my passport. Why would I considering my passport is British so I wouldn't want any language on it besides those that belong within British culture. I wouldn't want anything but English but would accept Welsh etc as they are part of the British identity.

How would having Irish on it, make you 'lesser'? He seems to think that 'different' is bad, yet Unionists are always stating that the UK is all about the differences coming together under one nation.

See answer above.

So why is it that there are Unionists like Willie whose idea of Unionism is so narrow that their identity is almost entirely made up of the common aspect of Britishness and almost completely shuns the aspect of Britishness where there are differences?

The Irish language in the republic is entirely diiferent from the Irish language in N.I, you don't come from here so I understand you find this hard to grasp. It would be no different for me trying to understand something in a country that I have never lived in or been part of. But I am trying to answer you as best I can to help you understand.

Also, we know the reality of the situation. There is Scots-Gaelic, Welsh and English on the passport. 3 of the 5 indigenous languages within the borders of the modern UK. None of the indigenous languages from NI are on it. So, Willie was right. NI is being treated differently, in that it is completely ignored. In this specific issue at least, there is no parity between the other home nations, who are all represented culturally on the passport, and NI.

Again you fail to grasp the reality of the situation. Up here for example the tri-colour represents the ira and all the hurt they caused, anything that involves sinn fein who were involved in that hurt both indirectly or directly is frowned upon. The tri-colour flying in the republic is not offensive in anyway shape or form. Sinn fein DO create and maintain division and conflict, now they are not soley to blame but when they stir up trouble then make demands they are not going to get to far. We are not looking or talking about any ordinary situation or circumstance, these things run much deeper.

I would also like to know why Unionists find Irish so offensive?

Again you are not grasping the situation. I love visiting Ireland, I have watched my Protestant neices collect prizes/trophies for Irish dancing which I thoroughly enjoyed, I have been to a few Irish musical festivals and I have a few mates who are fluent in Irish and I enjoy there speak as it is foreign and alien to me but interesting to listen to. So to say that Unionists find Irishness offensive is untrue although there may be a few. Sinn fein have constantly defended and supported the hurt they inflicted on Unionists, they are masters at winding people up, offending them and then twisting it around so it is they that are offended. When sinn fein are behind something then i raises suspicion as there is usually an alterior motive. If anyone thinks Unionists rightly or wrongly are going to agree to everything on sinn feins wish list then they are very much mistaken considering the hurt is still fresh for so many, and not forgetting sinn fein are still at there antics of double speak and hypocricy. So what else can people expect.

English originated from franco/german languages, Irish and Scots Gaelic are both indigenous to these islands (now that the Celtic invasion theory is being put to bed), which means that in Unionist logic, Irish would be more British than English, and is the cultural glue between Scotland and Ireland. Irish and Scots Gaelic are very similar, and they only started to diverge as late as the 17th century.

Not in the slightes bit important IMO whether what you said above is true or not. Doesn't come into it.

[Harry]

If its the case as been stated here he has made a bollocks of himself. My Passport is British and as such i expect all the language to be in English. If me living in N.Ireland meant that my British passport came with Irish writing on it but people living in England, Wales, Scotland etc didn't have this on theirs then i'd be fcuked off. He's jumped the gun and it looks like he's made himself look silly and his comments to go way over the top. If however other languages of the British Isles are being put on all passports nowadays then i'm grand with it and even if there was Irish on there. I'm not anti irish in anyway but would feel annoyed if N.Irish british passports had Irish but the rest of the UK did. Willie would be quite entitled to express this view but he goes OTT